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2015 British GP

Talk about the Teams & Drivers

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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Paolo 2 on Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:47 am

Lyria wrote:it's potentially going to be a wet race on Sunday now.


Let's hope that Zeus sends some rain towards Silverstone on Saunday, and while he does so let's hope that he remembers the poor souls of Londiunium and sends some rain our way too

A wet race at Silverstone would be a classic, watching it from the comfort of a properly colled down living room would be even better
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Lyria on Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:17 pm

Paolo 2 wrote:
Lyria wrote:it's potentially going to be a wet race on Sunday now.


Let's hope that Zeus sends some rain towards Silverstone on Saunday, and while he does so let's hope that he remembers the poor souls of Londiunium and sends some rain our way too

A wet race at Silverstone would be a classic, watching it from the comfort of a properly colled down living room would be even better


Paolo, there are going to be thunderstorms Friday night into Saturday (that will cool things down) and now there is an outside chance of a shower on Sunday for the race. Our weather is fickle, yesterday we had 34C and humid air, today we have 22C and fresher air. We have all the windows open to try and cool our house down and I'm actually enjoying the fact I have goosebumps :hihi:

A wet race is always good, but it adds to the impression that all we get here is rain, when we know it's not.

Sakae wrote: Where is "thumbs up" emoji?


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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Thu Jul 02, 2015 8:47 pm

Lyria wrote:
Sakae wrote:Crowd of 150,000 visitors are expected on a race day in forthcoming race. Hamilton is being touted in almost all quarters as a crowd-puller, notwithstanding unfair advantage Mercedes maintains through locked up competitive development, despite him living in Monaco, and despite that almost every chance he gets he is everywhere but in GB. Good for him, but if F1 chiefs blaming Vettel and likes for low attendance of various events, and Hamilton is saving the day, where was he then with his pulling force in races like Austria and Germany? Facts are, GB likes someone to win something for them, regardless how he gets it, no problem, but as far as challenges F1 faces, they aren't going away, Hamilton or not, and FOM with FiA hopefully are aware of them.


Just so you know, I know a lot of F1 fans around here and I don't know ANYONE who wants Hamilton to win. I sure as hell don't. What all the people I know want is a good race!!


Warning, after a day today of 33C where I am, 36.7C in other parts of the country, it's potentially going to be a wet race on Sunday now. Mind you that could change again between now and then, our weather changes on an hourly basis, ahh the joys of living on a small island that can easily be affected by weather systems from all directions :reallyevil:

Well, I can see Silverstone 'wing' on the horizon from the field next to my house, and I want him to win?!

I'm not sure I like being lectured on why people in the UK should NOT like a kid from Stevenage come good, nor insinuations that somehow we hate Vettel (Red Bull is a Milton Keynes institution). Neither are true. The Silverstone crowd are major F1 fans, and seriously appreciate skill, regardless of the source.

Just please, stop with invective and insinuation.

That said, I agree that bar a major thunderous downpor (perfectly possible, we got one yesterday), Mercs will walk it, and first corner will probably determine the winner. A shame, really.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Lyria on Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:58 am

f1datavis wrote:
Lyria wrote:
Just so you know, I know a lot of F1 fans around here and I don't know ANYONE who wants Hamilton to win. I sure as hell don't. What all the people I know want is a good race!!


Warning, after a day today of 33C where I am, 36.7C in other parts of the country, it's potentially going to be a wet race on Sunday now. Mind you that could change again between now and then, our weather changes on an hourly basis, ahh the joys of living on a small island that can easily be affected by weather systems from all directions :reallyevil:

Well, I can see Silverstone 'wing' on the horizon from the field next to my house, and I want him to win?!

I'm not sure I like being lectured on why people in the UK should NOT like a kid from Stevenage come good, nor insinuations that somehow we hate Vettel (Red Bull is a Milton Keynes institution). Neither are true. The Silverstone crowd are major F1 fans, and seriously appreciate skill, regardless of the source.

Just please, stop with invective and insinuation.

That said, I agree that bar a major thunderous downpor (perfectly possible, we got one yesterday), Mercs will walk it, and first corner will probably determine the winner. A shame, really.


f1datavis, all I said was I personally don't know anyone among my group of (off forum) friends and family who want him to win, and I honestly don't.

Oh and as for Hamilton being the kid from Stevenage (which is known for being a tough rundown area) he isn't. I know someone who grew up with him, he actually lived in one of the posh, exclusive little villages in the area and he didn't have anything like the tough start he/the press seem to like to portray.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:57 pm

I thought that up until the age of eight he lived with his mum on Shepall council estate?

This is where he grew up, 57 Peartree Way, Stevenage, until his Mum's partner wanted to move to London, and he wanted to stay in Stevenage so he moved in with his Dad and step-mum.

http://goo.gl/maps/rCcY8

Honestly doesn't seem like silver spoon territory?
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:01 pm

Oh, and his dad was a clerk for British Rail, and worked two extra jobs to fund his karts career.

Honestly don't see the middle class comfortable upbringing you are talking about.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Lyria on Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:14 pm

f1datavis wrote:I thought that up until the age of eight he lived with his mum on Shepall council estate?

This is where he grew up, 57 Peartree Way, Stevenage, until his Mum's partner wanted to move to London, and he wanted to stay in Stevenage so he moved in with his Dad and step-mum.

http://goo.gl/maps/rCcY8

Honestly doesn't seem like silver spoon territory?

Oh, and his dad was a clerk for British Rail, and worked two extra jobs to fund his karts career.

Honestly don't see the middle class comfortable upbringing you are talking about.


I was only repeating what I was told by someone I know who told me they knew him when they were growing up. I hadn't actually looked into it, I believed him. If that was wrong then I'm sorry. So I've had a look for myself.

His mother might have lived on a council estate in Stevenage but his father lived in the rather comfy village of Tewin, that is where he partly grew up shuttling between both his parents until, as you say, she moved to London and he moved in with his father and step mother.

So in some ways we're both sort of right.

Oh and let's get one thing right, I never said he came from silver spoon territory, I used the word 'posh' as that is how the village was described to me, I don't know it personally. I just said he didn't grow up in the quite the circumstances the he and/or the press like to portray, they love to push the council estate part, they neglect to mention the other side, that's all.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Sakae on Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:09 pm

How many F1 dreamers and hopefuls can boast to be groomed by McLaren from young age, and call it living from a paycheck to paycheck on social subsistence? I do not want to get involved too much in this topic, but my perception is that from certain age he always had a silver spoon handed to him, yet the outcome, two WDC are somewhat eyebrow rising results. First one, far from being decisive IMHO, and second one under full anti-competitive protection for one team. Big deal. Now he can arrive from his foreign residence, and wave a flag at his place of birth to drum up some public support that Eccleston appreciate so much. Hard to say what is genuine and what is fake. Alonso, in contrast, as much as I don't like the guy for other traits of his personality, at least is steady to his roots, which in some way I admire on a man. Vettel and Schumacher both live in Switzerland, Rosberg in Monaco, true enough, but I do not detect any body-wrapping into their national flag when they visit their home towns in Germany. Point is, someone likes Hollywood style in PR, others couldn't care less, or are turned away. Obviously I belong to later.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Paolo 2 on Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:00 pm

I don't want to be dragged into an argument, but I've never met anyone in karting who could be described as "poor" or significantly below average, there were many kids who couldn't be described as posh or particularly polished or sophisticated whose fathers might have been small garage owners or that sort of stuff, but still their parents could afford to buy them a go-kart, new tyres for each race, a caravan to sleep at the races and so on. Then there were very few kids that could be described as posh, Nico Rosberg certainly fits the bill, but I'd say that in the good old days you were posh even if your dad didn't own a private jet (like Keke).

The only kids that I'm aware of who managed to get into karting from a situation of relative poverty are the Schumacher brothers and the only reason why they did so was that their father was looking after the karting track in Kerpen, had he done something else he would have never been able to pay for their first go-karts.

there are obviously lucky circumstances, I started karting because the children of the guy who owned the house next door to my parents at the sea side used to own a karting track (and a few other things), I was a very close friend of his kids, he let me try it and I was faster so he let me race (I have never owned a go-kart and I'm 100% sure that my parents would never buy me one). But my parents still had to be able to afford to buy my gear, take the 4 of us around Italy and then Europe for race week ends, etc, it wasn't cheap. Karting is not like football, where underprivileged kids can get a chance quite easily, karting is more expensive

So probably Hamilton wasn't born with a silver spoon in his mouth but he's not even the rough kid from the council estate turned good, he's probably somewhere in between, like most of the other chaps he races very other week end.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:29 pm

No. Shuttling back and forth is not quite right. He lived with his Mum, was schooled locally and spent weekends with his Dad. That is not growing up in a posh neighbourhood, its a crap situation for a young kid. In any case, Lyria you brought this up as some form of refutation of my point that the reason that people in the UK like Hamilton is because he is a 'stevanage kid come good'. It's rubbish. He is not some posh kid who had an easy time, he earned his way up through massive sacrifices of his father and through being talented, despite an utterly rubbish situation in which his parents split up. Dismissing all that (just because you don't like him) doesn't make it true.

On Sakae's point, that RD somehow tapped him up and his career was set due to that is also rubbish. Hamilton had the precociousness (obviously, a trait still evident today) to tap RD when still karting, and the response was 'talk to me in a few years'. Him and his Dad (whom only at this point forward set up his own business and started to have success, which involved money in the family for the first time) worked getting him through very junior ranks single seaters via Manor Motorsport and others. Only once that success had come, did McLaren reach out to him.

I stand by my point. I've never said Hamilton's family circumstances were overly hard or in any way exceptional, but people see his past as like them, and like a flawed character.

Hamilton is massively popular in the UK (just look at the flags in the crowd?) and almost everyone I know admires his talent. Saying that it is somehow synthetic just because everyone you know does not feel that way again does not make it the majority opinion, though I agree he is divisive.

Attempting to disparage him because he lives abroad, he should be shunned, is presumptive of others views, and arrogantly dismissive of the British public as somehow imbeciles and only you know better. I note the dismissal of the co-tax exile drivers who don't fit the argument are deemed okay as they 'don't wrap themselves up in the flag'.

Well....
Image

I know you both don't support Hamilton, that's fine. What I do not get is that the way you feel so utterly negative about him, actively attacking his driving, his character, his past, everything - I just feel it is too much. I like listening to, watching drive and seeing success is all the drivers on the grid (except maybe Maldonado, though I enjoy watching him drive for possible the wrong reason).

Basically, I dislike, a lot, the hostility. This exact argument, and the complete inability to see another side of the argument is what has basically driven me from enjoying this forum.

For the record, Vettel is a great, funny guy and a great driver. So is Rosberg. There are drivers on the grid I would love to see win more than Hamilton - Hulkenberg being one, the TR boys, but Hamilton won my over in that 2007 rookie season with his raciness, and his flaws. Probably the same reason I like following Montoya, Raikkonen, etc.
Last edited by f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:31 pm

Paolo 2 wrote:I don't want to be dragged into an argument, but I've never met anyone in karting who could be described as "poor" or significantly below average, there were many kids who couldn't be described as posh or particularly polished or sophisticated whose fathers might have been small garage owners or that sort of stuff, but still their parents could afford to buy them a go-kart, new tyres for each race, a caravan to sleep at the races and so on. Then there were very few kids that could be described as posh, Nico Rosberg certainly fits the bill, but I'd say that in the good old days you were posh even if your dad didn't own a private jet (like Keke).

The only kids that I'm aware of who managed to get into karting from a situation of relative poverty are the Schumacher brothers and the only reason why they did so was that their father was looking after the karting track in Kerpen, had he done something else he would have never been able to pay for their first go-karts.

there are obviously lucky circumstances, I started karting because the children of the guy who owned the house next door to my parents at the sea side used to own a karting track (and a few other things), I was a very close friend of his kids, he let me try it and I was faster so he let me race (I have never owned a go-kart and I'm 100% sure that my parents would never buy me one). But my parents still had to be able to afford to buy my gear, take the 4 of us around Italy and then Europe for race week ends, etc, it wasn't cheap. Karting is not like football, where underprivileged kids can get a chance quite easily, karting is more expensive

So probably Hamilton wasn't born with a silver spoon in his mouth but he's not even the rough kid from the council estate turned good, he's probably somewhere in between, like most of the other chaps he races very other week end.


Agree completely, he is an average person from Stevenage. But Lyria said that this wasn't true, and that he came from a posh village outside the town. It's rubbish. I also very much dislike being dismissed as a "true fan".
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Lawrence on Fri Jul 03, 2015 7:26 pm

The hero of the story is Hamilton's dad, who busted his tail to get him where he is.
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Lawrence on Fri Jul 03, 2015 7:34 pm

f1datavis wrote:Basically, I dislike, a lot, the hostility. This exact argument, and the complete inability to see another side of the argument is what has basically driven me from enjoying this forum.


Yea, I have been feeling a little lonely lately....
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby f1datavis on Fri Jul 03, 2015 7:40 pm

Lawrence wrote:
f1datavis wrote:Basically, I dislike, a lot, the hostility. This exact argument, and the complete inability to see another side of the argument is what has basically driven me from enjoying this forum.


Yea, I have been feeling a little lonely lately....

What riles me most is that I adore watching a grand Prix of 20 plus brilliant drivers, even the pay ones. I can play okay tennis, kick a football as good as most, but I am certain I couldn't make an F1 go round the block, let alone blast through Stowe in 5th. "True fans like Vettel", yep hands up - he's deffo one skilled lad. But also liking and enjoying Hamilton's success, don't go there...
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Re: 2015 British GP

Postby Sakae on Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:59 pm

There is no need for me to apologize for being a fan of one driver, and feel indifferent to other two, so frequently, if not daily, touted as crème de la crème in current crop. I am almost certainly out of mainstream, but I don't buy that mantra, and my position is not merely emotional. It is totality of all what I see, learned, from far back to present day. Take it as "my flaw", but I watch a driver as a man with certain personality with which I am, or I am not comfortable with, rather than substituting driver for a skillful robot sitting in the cockpit.

I read a lot all kind of literature for a few hours a day, and F1 has its place on my calendar, yet if someone in here thinks that my position is one sided, that's fine, but I have no time, nor will to follow 20 drivers. There is pragmatic side of it. If someone wants to sing ode about other drivers, go ahead, I say. On this forum in recent time we were probably just four Vettel's fans. One hasn't posted for many months now, other dribbles in once in a while, thus its just Lyria and I who have anything kind to say about Sebastian on regular basis. Considering all contributing members, that seems like a lot, but I assure you, occasionally I visit and read (not posting) some other forums, and quite often I have to perform a search to find a post in reference to Vettel, and once I find some odd comments, then I learn how EVERYONE (whoever is included in that set) hates this driver around the globe; such is a life. If someone wants to write about Hamilton, no one but moderators can prevent you from doing so; stop moaning then, and go ahead, I say. In all likelyhood you won't hear from me, until Hamilton opens again his mouth and takes a few cheap shots, something he is famous by now.
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